Derren Brown: Archive
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From: Philip Collins
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 1:06pm
Subject: Re: [Derren Brown] Re: General stuff on MC3
Each time i watch it i change my own mind, that second woman really did
apppear to be completely confused and looked as though she had experienced
something really weird. I dont think derren would be low enough to ever set
anything up ahead of time but I certainly dont rule out setting up when he
got there. Derren is much more likely to use an 'instant stooge' I believe
that not even the camera crew knew how this was done. I believe that the
first time when he went up alone was when he handed over the money and got
her in on the act for the second time. The third time I dont know, I refuse
to believe that its that easy however else like I say he'd be doing it alot
and keeping it under his hat not doing it in t.v.
Areyou familiar with anchoring? Maybe derren has been a few times and each
time he has won he has gone up to the woman and anchored her state of paying
him money on authentic winners with the word WINdow or seomthing like that
and once that is set up its real from then on!
Thats the best i can do.
Whaddya think?
>From: gordo_ala_moore
>Reply-To:
>To:
>Subject: [Derren Brown] Re: General stuff on MC3
>Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 15:29:47 -0000
>
>Yes, I agree Derren will go to any length to make a trick appear
>real, and the woman with the smirk as I said earlier was definitely
>in on the trick. However, It was clear that that second woman
>was `duped' and was entered into a state of confusion, which
>ultimately resulted in Derren getting paid i.e. the trick was a
>resounding success. From a hypnosis/waking suggestion perspective, a
>clap of the hands or a snap of the fingers along with a confidently
>delivered suggestion can make a person forget their own name. As I
>am fully aware his acts are often hit and miss, and the second woman
>may well have been a hit, is this also not plausible.
>
> Assuming pattern interrupt is not the technique used, and I also
>doubt no pre-show covert trance was used, I sincerely hope it wasn't
>a simple case of "Derren's people contacting the track and
>arranging the full stunt" . Since I believe Derren's trick is not
>much better than Blain's levitation, or Uri's spoon bending, if that
>is the case.
>
>Do you have an intermediate theory you can suggest?
>
>Could he have bet on the winner of a previous race with the same
>number? Or something along similar such lines.
>
>Cheers, Gordon
>
>P.S. I still for some reason can see past waking suggestion, even
>having read Pure Effect, Bancheck etc. Maybe I am more duped than
>that woman !
>
>
>--- In a previous message Philip Collins wrote:
> > I've said it before but ill say it again, it's not REAL. its TV
>anyone who
> > has read 'pure effect' please back me up. Derren is the kind of guy
>who will
> > go to any extreme to present the most amazing effects. what makes
>this trick
> > really amazing is that anyone who doesnt believe in hypnosis/nlp
>cant
> > understand how it was done and anyone who studies
>trance/subconcious mind
> > and pattern interupts as part of nlp thinks to themselves wow this
>guy has
> > taken this skill far beyond I have seen it used before.
> > What i'm saying is that Derren knows people will spend ages trying
>to find
> > out about interupting patterns because according to the theory
>these kinds
> > of things do work and they do work. But that is not what is
>happening here.
> > DOnt get me wrong I believe that with some pre-show covert hypnosis
>and a
> > pre installed suggestion could have been the method used but its
>unlikely.
> > Think about it the first woman was set up when derren went up with
>the first
> > ticket. "oh yeah sorry you have won" she is obvious with her smile.
>The
> > second woman in order for it to be what derren wants us to believe
>it was
> > i.e pattern inturrept, confusion and subliminal commands then this
>pattern
> > interupt would have had to generate a visual hallucination as she
>was
> > reading the machine.
> > I'm not saying she wasn't duped necessarily but I am saying it
>can't be done
> > without some pre-show work and If I was derren and i wanted to do a
>trick
> > like that as part of one of my shows then I would surely think of
>an easier
> > and RELIABLE method. Think about it with clear eyes if that were
>true then
> > derren would be working for MI5 not channel 4.
> > In fact he wouldnt be working at all he'd be at the dog's 24-7.
> > THe fact that we spend time reading up on pattern interrupts is a
>credit to
> > his performance his book pure effect clearly states that he aims
>for his
> > audiences to have some idea of how it was done at the end of his
>shows.
> > "Decide what it would look like of you could really do it. Hint at
>the
> > method you would use if you really could do it and let them draw
>conclusions
> > for themselves"
> >
> >
> >
> > >From: gordo_ala_moore
> > >Reply-To:
> > >To:
> > >Subject: [Derren Brown] Re: General stuff on MC3
> > >Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 10:05:24 -0000
> > >
> > >The pattern (unit of operation performed by the subconscious),
>could
> > >be the woman's entire night, or her serving of each individual
> > >punter, but more then likely it is the processing of each ticket.
>I
> > >still have my reservations about the first time he bangs on the
> > >glass, I believe with this one, the woman is playing along. The
> > >second woman on the other hand, the bang is used to startle the
> > >woman's subconscious making it receptive to the next suggestion.
> > >There are many waking suggestion tricks that utilise this, as well
>as
> > >several rapid inductions.
> > >
> > >I know what you are saying about interrupting the `pattern', when
> > >there is no clear pattern. But I bet if you asked the woman to
> > >describe a person she had just served, or on what race the previous
> > >ticket claimed was, she would not be able to tell you. It is
>likely
> > >that a great deal of her actions doing such repetitive task, are
>out
> > >with her normal consciousness.
> > >On occasion when I would go to the supermarket, I would state to
>the
> > >person at the checkout "Doesn't that awful background music drive
> > >you", and observer the expression on their face as they `wake up'.
> > >
> > >Cheers, Gordon
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >--- In a previous message vlaca_malacca"
> wrote:
> > > > --- In a previous message gordo_ala_moore wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > I have always assumed the betting track was pure pattern
> > >interrupt,
> > > >
> > > > That's where I have a problem.
> > > > What pattern is Derren interrupting? I can't make out any
>automatic
> > > > movement which is not normally interrupted. I can't see how
>banging
> > > > on a windowframe can do anything other than momentarily shock
>the
> > > > victim.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > P.S. is "tranceformations" any good, i have been swithering
>about
> > > > > forking out for a second hand "Hypnotic realities", but may by
> > > > > tranceformations instead. depending on your feedback. is it
> > > > > too "therapyish"?
> > > >
> > > > Well, 'Tranceformations' is the very first book I've read on the
> > > > subject of NLP, and I have taken many, many notes from it. It's
> > > > really just a transcription of a weekend at an NLP seminar with
> > > > Bandler et al. The first 100 pages are totally engrossing.
> > > >
> > > > Instead of forking out significant amounts of cash, I managed to
> > > > locate a copy in my University library (which has a price
>sticker
> > >of
> > > > £8.99 on the cover, while Amazon are selling 2nd hand versions
>for
> > > > £30-£40!). See if you can hypnotise a student and get a version
> > >that
> > > > way.
> > > >
> > > > Hope this helps,
> > > >
> > > > Tim
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
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| Replies | Author | Yahoo! ID | Date | Size |
| 1829: Anchoring | happany | happany | Mon 09/12/2002 | 10 KB |
| 1831: Re: Anchoring | Blue Chip | cs_bluechip | Mon 09/12/2002 | 14 KB |
| 1832: Dog Track | happany | happany | Mon 09/12/2002 | 11 KB |
