Derren Brown: Archive
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From: singhstealth
Date: Thu Jan 9, 2003 5:08pm
Subject: Re: do John Edward and Collin Fry use cold reading???
wassup
you guys need to watch the shows more-you may be right about the
AMOUNT of 'hits' they get but many of the ones they do get are
exrtemely specific. Some include things like knowing that they liked
a particular food, knowing what there last words were or even silly
jokes, you just cant find this info anywhere but from mics the family
of the dead or the 'spirits'. And that thing about the coach and all
the other info on James Randi's site is highly likely to be a warm
pile of crap seeing as there was only one guy who claimed this-these
claims were heavy and surely others would have picked up on it. But
Rob, you are right that if these people are frauds there really is no
excuse. And yeah, Ian Rowland, quality-there is a forum called the
magic cafe-if you read the book or your intersted in cold reading go
sign up there because he comes on all the time with some VERY
intersting information on a whole range of topics not just cold
reading. He also has his very detailed skeptical views on John Edward
on his website somewhere.
peace
--- In a previous message Rob Dobson wrote:
> Completely agree. I'm not even sure if the fact it
> makes people feel better excuses it. If you've got
> untreatable cancer, and a doctor says you haven't on
> the grounds it makes you feel better, is that
> excusable?
>
> Incidentally, although it's probably been mentioned
> before, 'The full facts book on cold reading' is THE
> book on the subject, only available from
> www.ian-rowland.com. There are 2 complete transcripts
> of cold readings that Ian did, along with discussions
> with the subject later. Top stuff. --- wayneryder wrote:
>
> <HR>
> <html><body>
>
>
> <tt>
> I'll go further on this. James Randi's site mentions
> some journalists
> not being allowed to record a John Edwards session,
> rather they had
> footage provided for them. There was a 'green room'
> with microphones
> hanging from the ceiling. There was also a mysterious
> coach that
> dropped off some guests who then didn't sit together.
> Edwards before
> editing gets 40-50% hits AT BEST. What you see is a
> very favourable
> version of the night's session.
> There's more available (and it won't contain my
> misquotes or
> misrememberings) on <a
> href="http://www.randi.org/">http://www.randi.org/</a>
> Have a snoop around the site.
>
> There was also something I read once which debunked
> one of the
> Dorises we had in circulation a while back (might've
> been Stokes,
> might not).
> Apparently she had a number of people in her entourage
> (it's a
> business, after all) who helped her compile
> information on potential
> subjects by location. People who go to psychics REALLY
> want to be
> reassured and contacted by their deceased friends
> & family. They
> write desperate reams of stuff to the psychic saying
> how much they
> miss John or Pam or whoever, and how they keep an item
> or picture to
> remind them and so on.
> So, a comprehensive database was constructed. When she
> was due to
> visit a town, the most likely people to turn up (and
> they do) were
> put to the top of the pile and studied before the
> show.
> Using this cache of information, she could then zero
> in on her
> targets, who wouldn't be able to remember exactly what
> they'd told
> her in their mail, and would be amazed at her
> astounding powers.
> Their reaction to the apparent bullseyes would amaze
> the rest of the
> audience, and the rest is mass hysteria.
>
> I once asked a friend, a devout Christian, what he
> thought of
> psychics. He considered this a moment and said,
> "There are an awful
> lot of charlatans around." On speaking to the
> dead, he was less
> committal. How could he answer without either saying
> 'they're lying'
> or 'dead's dead'?
> There's a Chinese proverb-type-thing that asks if
> you'd wake the
> family to tell them the house was on fire and they
> were all going to
> die.
> If people are made happy by going to a psychic show,
> good luck to
> them. Some may even suspect there's no truth in it,
> but still they'll
> go.
> If it helps them, that's a good thing and that's what
> counts.
>
> The problem with outing these people is that their
> hands are really
> on the chicken switch. Dare to confront them, and you
> might incur the
> wrath of the whole audience, who are naturally biased
> in the
> psychic's favour. And who would admit to being a fake
> and misleading
> so many people in such a callous way?
> If I ever see John Edwards say something like,
> "I'm getting a Maureen
> here, wants to speak to Jim. Jim, the $50 you lost was
> in some
> trousers she washed and the money was ruined and she
> never dared tell
> you. The remains of the money are propping up the
> dresser." -then I
> MIGHT think differently. But only if the ruined wad of
> notes turned
> out to be there after all.
>
> Till then, I don't believe a single one of them.
> Apologies to anyone of a sensitive religious nature,
> but as my friend
> couldn't say, but I can: They're lying, dead's
> dead.
>
>
>
> --- In a previous message "Ben Green"
> wrote:
> > Ok, to get onto a tv show in the UK or the
> States you apply to the
> tv station or production company who post you the
> tickets. I think
> it is fair to assume that 99% of the people who do ask
> for tickets
> are recently bereaved and also are believers.
> Once you have a name
> and address how hard is it to find out who in their
> family has died?
> Death certificates, obituaries, newspaper articles.
> Add some nice
> cold reading, some funky editing and
> voila..........instant
> psychic!!!!
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: singhstealth
> > To:
> > Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2003
> 8:40 PM
> > Subject: [Derren Brown] do John
> Edward and Collin Fry use cold
> reading???
> >
> >
> > Now, for those of you who dont know,
> John Edward and Collin Fry
> are
> > self proclaimed psychics and appear
> on Uk Living pretty much
> > everyday. Esentially they claim they
> can speak to dead people.
> >
> > I am absolutely staggered by how
> accurate these guys get, so much
> so
> > that I think they are for real or
> they are bloody good actors.
> > Some of u may say that the very
> people they read are actors-no
> way-
> > one only has to look at there
> reactions and 'post reading
> analyisis'
> > to understand that they are real
> people coming to meet there dead
> > relatives or friends.
> >
> > In cold reading, you need to look at
> body language and facial
> > expressions almost constantly to
> create answers that satisfy the
> > sitter. These guys are always looking
> at the floor or plain
> walls,
> > apparently so they can get the
> 'images' they recieve clearer. The
> > footage could have been edited,
> true.
> >
> > Also if you watch there shows, when
> they are 'in contact with the
> > dead' they remark on unbelievably
> specific information. Cold
> readers
> > and skeptics would put this down to a
> lucky wild stab which cold
> > readers use to boost there appearence
> as being more autentic. But
> > cold readers use this rarely and
> there success is quite poor-but
> they
> > make an excuse like "think about
> it later" or "watch out for it"
> thus
> > turning there incorrect guesses into
> a hit. Incidentally John
> Edward
> > and Collin Fry do use these type of
> statements but when they
> > say "think about it
> later"-the people they tell this to end up
> > remembering the information that was
> claimed and describing it in
> > the 'post reading analyis'. It is
> posible that the production
> team
> > for there programmes include
> investigators, people who go on the
> net
> > or whatever to look up information on
> the people for the next
> show-
> > and perhaps now and then find lots of
> different info...but the
> things
> > that these psychics come out with is
> just far too specific to
> find on
> > any website or in any family tree. So
> they use mic's then-doubt
> it,
> > after being accused of cheating by
> certain skeptics, John Edward
> was
> > forced to allow people to investigate
> the set used for the
> programme-
> > after looking and trying-the
> skeptical claims of the use of
> > stratigically placed microphones went
> out the window.
> >
> > John Edward speaks very fast and
> comes out with a lot of
> information
> > and cold readers beieve this to be a
> very effective techinque-if
> you
> > throw loads of information at the
> sitter, u increase the chance
> of
> > getting something right, and when
> they acknoledge and nod there
> head
> > they may be only acknoledging one
> piece of information out of
> many
> > more. I think this is the beggest
> skeptical claim John Edward has
> > had...but what about Collin Fry? he
> definately does'nt speak fast
> at
> > all, his pace seems to stay alomst
> constant throughout the show.
> > Either there is no way he is using
> this technique or he uses it
> very
> > covertely.
> >
> > Its a close call in my opinion. If
> they are cold readers they're
> VERY
> > good. Im always changing my mind but
> at the moment I beileve them.
> >
> > Collin Fry's show is called '6ixth
> sense with Colin Fry' and
> comes on
> > uk living pretty much everyday at
> some point as does John
> Edward's
> > which is called 'Crossing Over with
> John Edward'. There is also
> > another 'psychic' called James Van
> Praag, I cant remember what
> his
> > show is called but you may want to
> see it because he is the most
> > contravercial out of the lot.
> >
> > sorry about the probably many
> spelling/punctuation errors, im
> lazy
> > and was pants at English GCSE,
> although I did get a C-I reckon
> papers
> > got switched for that one-no way was
> I on a C! I got a C in
> german as
> > well, the only one in my class to
> pass it-good tip, use alta
> vista's
> > translater for ALL the
> coursework-thats how I passed. Im only
> really
> > good at mathsy type things (B in
> maths and science)-and the only
> one
> > I failed was music, got a D-would
> have been an F had the teacher
> not
> > done all my coursework. Damn, what
> prankster!
> >
> > Peace out
> >
> >
> >
>
> >
> >
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> > [e-mail address removed]
> >
> >
> >
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> >
> >
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