Derren Brown: Archive
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From: Blue Chip
Date: Thu Dec 19, 2002 10:35am
Subject: Fwd: Re: hypnosis practice.
>> > >So for being such a pessimist, but NLP is starting to seem a little
>> > >cheesy to me, a good way of for the creators to make money. I don't
>> > >know why I feel like that, I just do!
>> >
>> > "A rose is still a rose by any other name"
>> > NLP is a trade marked term. And for as long as we live in a
>>capitalist
>> > society, we will have to accept that many judge their position in
>>society
>> > by the amount of money they have. And after all, it's all
>>about "whatever
>> > makes you happy" at the end of the day.
>> > Do not be discouraged that some people do this for money. There
>>really are
>> > some great skills to be learned - one being the skill in finding
>>harmony in
>> > the world you live in - a world generally full of idiots; everyone,
>>that
>> > is, except YOU. (did you feel my tongue reach out toward your
>>bottom
>> > crevice there?)
>>
>>Uhh, I dont think so, I mean, I HOPE NOT!! :)
>
>LOL
>
>>They must be making a "killing" on NLP I'm thinking. I recently
>>brought frogs into princes for around £11.95, I haven't read it yet,
>>but when I looked at the back, it said the book had sold over 250,000
>>copies. Then when I looked at the new editions publishing date, it
>>was quite some years back, so undoubtely sales numbers would have
>>doubled or tripled by then atleast, yet I stuck to those numbers:
>>
>>250,000 * £11.95 = A hell of dosh by any standards... Almost 3
>>million pounds, on ONE book!
>>
>>Maybe thats why I feel a little sckeptical when it comes to NLP.
>
>Yes, I have a similar problem with Harry Potter. Why should I have to pay
>when J K Rowling has so much money that doesn't know what to do with
>it. I mean, it's not like I am actually going to learn anything by
>reading/watching/hearing it (no smell-o-vision yet) and still I have to
>pay to experience it >:(
>
> > > > > It has little use in the real world, as many people are scared
>>of
>> > > > hypnosis, and worried about loosing cotrol, and closing their
>>eyes,
>> > > > etc
>> > >
>> > >Agreed here also,
>> >
>> > You need to look at your skills in conciously "inducing a state of
>> > psychological comfort with your 'partner'" or "rapport" (as it has
>>been
>> > termed.)
>>
>>Sorry, I dont really understand what you mean here...
>
>What I mean is (1) "rapport" is easier to say and (2) if you had good
>rapport, you would have no problems finding someone on whom to practice
>your hypnosis.
>
>Without good rapport, you will never hypnotise anyone :(
>
>> > > while I don't know that much about NLP, I do feel
>> > >that a lot of unecessary technical terms are used, and I think that
>> > >someone else here said this also... It just adds to the 'fakeness'
>>of
>> > >it all I believe...
>> >
>> > brb, lol, cya, ram-drive, pci bus, hard drive, floppy, stiffy (for
>>all
>> > south african members), CRT, RGB, VGA
>> >
>> > Once you have a definition for each word, then it is easier to
>>say "anchor"
>> > than "make a thing happen, then do a special different thing such
>>that when
>> > the second thing is repeated the first thing is triggered again."
>> >
>> > The opening pages to Douglas Adams 'Mostly Harmless' (a generally
>>crap book
>> > imho) explains this quite well in (as I recall) four sentences
>>spread over
>> > four pages... "anchor" is still a simpler term to use in general
>>discussion
>> > - particularly on specialist news groups.
>>
>>Right, I had a feeling somebody would do that. It was quite a poor
>>argument that I used.
>
>If you want to be a part of any club/group/tribe you need to talk the
>talk. You will not be accepted into a computer techie group until you
>understand what a tcp/ip stack is. You cannot be a mechanic if you have
>no idea why the Big End is named so. You shouldn't try to me a
>psychologist without at least an understanding of Freudian theories.
>
>If you need to have everything explained to you a hundred times - which is
>what will happen if you don't use abbreviative terms - then all you need
>to do is read the definition a hundred times.
>
>Now that you know what "Anchoring" is, tell me this... What word(s) do you
>think SHOULD have been used. What would have satisfied YOU? What
>descriptive method would YOU have chosen if you had concluded the
>same. Really, serious question.
>
>Rather than sitting there typing that "you have a poor argument <the end>"
>(lousy rapport skills, dude) why say WHY you think this is so. Or I'm
>gonna end up like John Cleese "yes it is, no it isn't, yes it is, no it
>isn't" - not much of a argument really!
>
>>The way that NLP is structured in a way that a computer program is,
>>intruigues but baffles me at the same time.
>
>Humans have ALWAYS been compared to the latest technology.
>This is because the latest technology is modelled on human behaviour.
>
>>I think I heard Richard
>>saying "Throw out the old code, and make some new code", and I
>>genuinely believed that he may have been talking about renovating
>>some C source code or something, when I finally remembered that I had
>>searched for NLP.
>
>I was computer programmer by trade for many years, and for me the
>comparison is a very comfortable one. If I can change the predicates upon
>which you make a decision, then I can change your decision. Call it
>programming or brainwashing (now there's a dumb word - how do you WASH
>someones Brain??) or indoctrination (www.dictionary.com) or NLP, it makes
>no difference, the effect is the same.
>
>>Is this done to help us or confuse us?
>
>It depends on which approach you take to it. If you want to learn
>everything overnight you WILL end up confused. Take your time, make a
>list of terms you do not understand and ask someone who does to dumb it
>down a bit for you ;)
>
>> > > > Covert Waking trance, though not as deep (unless
>>experienced) on
>> > > > the other hand is much more useful for persuading people in
>>terms
>> > >of
>> > > > sales / seduction / friendships / Negotiation and Persuasion.
>> > > >
>> > >
>> > >Right, I love the waking stuff. While I'm still ploughing through
>>the
>> > >Encyclopedia of Stage Hypnotism, the waking stuff is very
>>intruiging
>> > >and seems to link very closely to what derren does in some of his
>> > >stunts.
>> >
>> > Would you be more specific about what you term a "Covert Waking
>>Trance"
>> > It kinda makes sense, but I could be way off.
>>
>>I didn't write 'Covert Waking Trance'.
>>
>>...I wrote 'the waking stuff', and what I meant by that was basically
>>waking hypnosis, or waking suggestion, simple things that can be done
>>without putting someone into a deep trance. Kinda rapid stuff Derren
>>does now and then!
>
>You mean like the "handshake induction"?
>Or his generally persuasive skills?
